Q&A with Representatives Tom Cole and Stephanie Bice re: DOGE

Last week, I had the chance to sit down for interviews with Rep. Tom Cole (R-OK4) and Rep. Stephanie Bice (R-OK5). One topic that each of them spoke with me about was President Trump’s much-talked-about Department of Government of Efficiency, or DOGE.

As a special employee of the White House, Elon Musk has been leading the efforts of the DOGE team to examine federal agencies and generate savings for taxpayers by eliminating spending that they deem to be “waste, fraud, and/or abuse.” Polls show that Americans generally support this effort, although they have an overall negative view of Musk and are concerned with the speed with which cuts are being made.

There have been many instances in the short time the group has been operating that workers have been fired, only to be recalled after DOGE realized the importance of the work they were doing. There have also been numerous legal challenges to many of the group’s actions. Suffice it to say, the work of DOGE thus far, as much as Americans favor the idea of making our tax dollars go further, has been highly controversial.

Alex: Do you have concerns with the way DOGE is operating?

Tom Cole: Well, I—it’s going fast. And look, I had Elon Musk in this office, talking to him about this in overall terms, not in Oklahoma-specific terms, but he said, ‘Look, we're going to make some mistakes. We are moving very fast—it's a lot of material. We don't always have context. But we'll correct the mistakes, people have to bring them to our attention.’ I think we brought some mistakes to their attention. The National Weather Center was one of them. And guess what? They agreed. ‘Yeah, maybe you're right about that, you know.’ We did the same thing with the Social Security office in Lawton. Lawton is a community of over 100,000 people. It's 100 miles away from anything remotely its size. So, it services not just itself, but its surrounding area. And it's a heavily trafficked office. We pointed that out. Guess what? ‘That makes sense.’ Indian Hospital in Oklahoma City is one of the best. And we have lots of lots of Indians in Oklahoma and lots of Indians in Oklahoma City that aren't any place near their tribal facilities. So that's a really important facility. So, again, you got to go make your case, though. It's the same thing you do—I've done this countless times. You know, it's the same thing you do during BRAC (Base Realignment and Closure). When we had our last BRAC that threatened to shut down Tinker Air Force Base. Believe me, I was pretty heavily engaged in making sure that everybody had any role in that decision. I understood the importance of Tinker, and we were successful. So, you’ve got to be able to advocate for your constituents to make the case. But, at the end of the day, there's nothing wrong with the executive branch looking at every facility. We have redundant facilities, we have waste. We're running a $2 trillion deficit. So, I'm not going to get mad at somebody who is bringing me ideas about how to save money. Instead, I'm going to say, ‘That's a good one, that's a good one, that's a good one, now this you might not understand, it's not so good. Here's why I think that.’ You know, Elon Musk doesn't get to make these decisions all by himself. The president—now that he has a cabinet—has already made it very clear, ‘Hey, these cabinet people have to decide, but, you know, you're in there to help us locate and do things.’ And, again, Musk told me we're going to move fast. We're going to make mistakes here or there, but then we're going to turn around, correct the mistakes. You've got to help us do that. That's fair. And that's what they're there to do.

Alex: In light of the listing of the Oklahoma City federal building for possible closure, are you—are your constituents—concerned with how fast some of these decisions are being made?

Stephanie Bice: Sure, there are concerns. I think I have we've heard from constituents that have called in or emailed into the office that are reading about the potential for layoffs, but I think—what I want Oklahomans to know is that it is not sort of this broad sweeping, you know, layoff that you're hearing about. There are strategic cuts being made, and certainly right now they are focusing on temporary, provisional employees. That means employees that have been there less than a year that may not be mission critical. When you're looking at Tinker (Air Force Base), you know, there's been discussions about some potential layoffs, but I think it's important to remember there's 27,000 employees on Tinker Air Force Base and, you know, if they're looking at reducing the numbers, you know, 400 or 500, it will not impact the mission of Tinker. And that's really my focus: making sure that the mission of Tinker Air Force base, the critical missions that we play, whether it's the AWACS or, KC 46A's, those missions continue to operate as usual.

Alex: Some people worry that federal workers are being dehumanized in this DOGE process. How do you see this?

Stephanie Bice: We have to have compassion for individuals that, you know, may be part of this reduction in force. And sometimes the language that's being utilized by Elon (Musk) or DOGE is not the way that I would speak to my constituents. I think understanding and recognizing that this is their livelihood and its importance to them is important, but we also have to realize that we're, as a country, you know, carrying almost $37 trillion in debt. And we can't continue to do the same things we've been doing over and over. We’ve got to figure out: how do we do things differently? And, like, this is a very unconventional way to address government, you know, bureaucracy and bloat, and I think that for most people, myself included, more of a strategic scalpel approach would be better. But, you know, this is the choice the president has made. And what I will continue to do is make sure that I am watching what's happening and advocating for, you know, those agencies or individuals that I think are important to the community, and a great example of that is the FAA. We heard some rumblings about layoffs at FAA, Secretary Duffy actually came to Oklahoma City last week and had a great visit at the facility. And we recognize that, yes, there may be some layoffs within certain segments of FAA, but overall, air traffic controllers are crucial, and he's looking to hire more of them.

Alex: Your long view of this is that we should and can have a federal government that works better and more efficiently?

Stephanie Bice: I think that's what President Trump is looking for: to reshape, and right-size government. That's his focus. When you have, you know, the layers and layers of bureaucracy that we see here, you know, there is a way for us to save money. There's a way for us to be more efficient and more effective, and doing things the same way over and over isn't achieving that. And so, I like to use the analogy, he's taking a hammer to it and putting everything back together in a way that may make more sense. It's uncomfortable. It is unconventional, but my hope is that it will be the right decision for the long term for the country.